When God created "Night" and "Heavens" in Genesis 1, were they not good?

[greenonions]

God says at the end of Genesis 1 that everything He had made was very good, so I think they were good. Perhaps the key is that God did not "see" that "night" and "heavens" were good at first, because there is nothing to see in darkness and empty space... that is until after God fills it with stars and birds. What do you think?

[Athanasius]

Maybe it's prefatory text with an explanation that follows, and so the 'very good' relates to it as well.

[Quantrill]

God says at the end of Genesis 1 that everything He had made was very good, so I think they were good. Perhaps the key is that God did not "see" that "night" and "heavens" were good at first, because there is nothing to see in darkness and empty space... that is until after God fills it with stars and birds. What do you think?

It's my opinion that the darkness is not a 'creation' of God, but is the absence of God.  (1 John 1:5)

Therefore darkness exists only if God removes His light.  And it will continue to exist until He turns the light back on.  (Gen. 1:3)

The 'Gap Theory' helps explain (Gen. 1:1-2).  I realize it is not popular among most Christians, but I believe it is Scriptural.

Quantrill

[Fenris]

What do you think?

I think even dark and empty space is a creation of God.

[Athanasius]

What do you think?

I think even dark and empty space is a creation of God.

I'm thinking I agree. Darkness, perhaps, being illustrative of the state of affairs sans God but still nevertheless a creation (being a 'feature' of the physical world, after all.)

[RabbiKnife]

I think humans are sort of funny when we start thinking that what we can observe with our physical senses or with instruments of steel and silicon that we've manufactured is all that God could do.

[RabbiKnife]

Andy yes, I'm a gapper.

[Athanasius]

Andy yes, I'm a gapper.

To be honest, Andy, that's what humanity got for messing with the Forerunners.

[The Parson]

I think humans are sort of funny when we start thinking that what we can observe with our physical senses or with instruments of steel and silicon that we've manufactured is all that God could do.

But that is the common misconception with man's feeble mind RK...

[Sojourner]

What do you think?

I think even dark and empty space is a creation of God.

I'm thinking I agree. Darkness, perhaps, being illustrative of the state of affairs sans God but still nevertheless a creation (being a 'feature' of the physical world, after all.)

Yep, God said He created darkness: I form the light and create the darkness; I bring prosperity and create calamity. I, the LORD, do all these things. (Isaiah 45:7) In the grand scheme of things, everything serves a purpose. While still trying to figure things out, scientists believe the majority of the cosmos is composed of dark matter and dark energy.

[Fenris]

Yep, God said He created darkness: I form the light and create the darkness; I bring prosperity and create calamity.

A batter translation from the Hebrew: עֹשֶׂ֥ה שָׁל֖וֹם וּב֣וֹרֵא רָ֑ע "I make peace and create evil" (which is how the KJV translates it). It also makes your point even more strongly that "everything serves a purpose".

[Athanasius]

Yep, God said He created darkness: I form the light and create the darkness; I bring prosperity and create calamity.

A batter translation from the Hebrew: עֹשֶׂ֥ה שָׁל֖וֹם וּב֣וֹרֵא רָ֑ע "I make peace and create evil" (which is how the KJV translates it). It also makes your point even more strongly that "everything serves a purpose".

What's your view on the evil that is created? For example, is this saying that God is responsible for moral evil, or that God is responsible for setting out the person who does evil, and so on?

[Fenris]

What's your view on the evil that is created? For example, is this saying that God is responsible for moral evil, or that God is responsible for setting out the person who does evil, and so on?

Everything comes from God.

Pharaoh and the Egyptians enslaved the Hebrews, as God told Abraham that his descendants would be slaves for 400 years. (Gen 15:13)

The Assyrians were the "rod of God's anger" (Isaiah 10:5) to punish Israel (the northern ten tribes). The Babylonians served the same function in 586BC.

The prophet rhetorically asks the question "Will there be evil in the city if the Lord has not done it?" (Amos 3:6)

So again, everything comes from God. It's all God's will, the good things and the bad. The place where free will enters the equation is when a person chooses their mission. It was God's will that the six million be killed, for reasons known to Him and not us. But nobody forced Hitler and the Nazis to be the ones to do it. No, they volunteered to do it. With joy. And for that they will receive the punishment they deserve.

As an aside, the Jewish internalization of this message is probably what enabled Judaism as a faith to survive the Babylonian exile. In the ancient world, when a nation was defeated, it was generally seen as a defeat of that nation's god or gods as well. Consequently those religions ceased to exist. Judaism was the only religion what saw the defeat of their nation as a victory for their God. Hence Judaism survived the exile, and Christianity exists today.

[gordon7]

God created the heaven and the earth.

The created earth had no form, darkness was upon the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

God said let there be light, and God divided the light from the darkness.

The light was called day, and the darkness He called night. ( The evening and the morning were the first day.)

In Isaiah 45, we know from the rising of the sun, that He is the Lord and none else. He forms the light and creates darkness.




There is not a word in our tongue, but, lo, the Lord, He knows it altogether. He has beset us behind and before, and laid His hand upon us.

Such knowledge is too wonderful for us; it is high, we cannot attain unto it.

Where can we go from His Spirit. ( the Spirit of the Lord that moved upon the face of the waters.) or where shall we go from His presence ?

He is there in heaven and hell, if we say surely the darkness shall cover us, even the night shall be light about us. ( the darkness does not hide from the Lord, but the night shines as the day, the darkness and the light are both alike to the Lord.)

God removes away the speech of the trusty, and takes away the understanding of the aged. He discovers deep things out of darkness, and brings out to light the shadow of death.

He takes away the heart of the chief of the people of the earth, and causes them to wander in a wilderness where there is no way. they grope in the dark without light, and He makes them to stagger like a drunken man.





Have we commanded the morning since our days; and caused the dayspring to know his place; that it might take hold of the ends of the earth, that the wicked might be shaken out of it?

From the wicked their light is withheld, and the high arm shall be broken.

Have the gates of death been opened unto us? or have we seen the doors of the shadow of death?

Where is the way where light dwells? and as for darkness, where is the place thereof, that we should take it to the bound thereof, and that we should know the paths to the house thereof? Do we know it, because we were born then? or because the number of our days is great?

Then Job answered the Lord, and said I know that you can do every thing, and that no thought can be withheld from you. Who is he that hides counsel without knowledge? therefore have I uttered what I understood not; things too wonderful for me, which I knew not.





Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.


Isaiah 45:6 That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the Lord, and there is none else.
7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.

Psalm 139:4 For there is not a word in my tongue, but, lo, O Lord, thou knowest it altogether.
5 Thou hast beset me behind and before, and laid thine hand upon me.
6 Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is high, I cannot attain unto it.

Psalm 139:7 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?
8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
9 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea;
10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.
11 If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me.
12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee.

Job 12:20 He removeth away the speech of the trusty, and taketh away the understanding of the aged.
21 He poureth contempt upon princes, and weakeneth the strength of the mighty.
22 He discovereth deep things out of darkness, and bringeth out to light the shadow of death.
23 He increaseth the nations, and destroyeth them: he enlargeth the nations, and straiteneth them again.
24 He taketh away the heart of the chief of the people of the earth, and causeth them to wander in a wilderness where there is no way.
25 They grope in the dark without light, and he maketh them to stagger like a drunken man.

Job 38:12 Hast thou commanded the morning since thy days; and caused the dayspring to know his place;
13 That it might take hold of the ends of the earth, that the wicked might be shaken out of it?
14 It is turned as clay to the seal; and they stand as a garment.
15 And from the wicked their light is withholden, and the high arm shall be broken.
16 Hast thou entered into the springs of the sea? or hast thou walked in the search of the depth?
17 Have the gates of death been opened unto thee? or hast thou seen the doors of the shadow of death?
18 Hast thou perceived the breadth of the earth? declare if thou knowest it all.
19 Where is the way where light dwelleth? and as for darkness, where is the place thereof,
20 That thou shouldest take it to the bound thereof, and that thou shouldest know the paths to the house thereof?
21 Knowest thou it, because thou wast then born? or because the number of thy days is great?


Job 42:1  Then Job answered the Lord, and said,
2 I know that thou canst do every thing, and that no thought can be withholden from thee.
3 Who is he that hideth counsel without knowledge? therefore have I uttered that I understood not; things too wonderful for me, which I knew not.

[Athanasius]

What's your view on the evil that is created? For example, is this saying that God is responsible for moral evil, or that God is responsible for setting out the person who does evil, and so on?

Everything comes from God.

Pharaoh and the Egyptians enslaved the Hebrews, as God told Abraham that his descendants would be slaves for 400 years. (Gen 15:13)

The Assyrians were the "rod of God's anger" (Isaiah 10:5) to punish Israel (the northern ten tribes). The Babylonians served the same function in 586BC.

The prophet rhetorically asks the question "Will there be evil in the city if the Lord has not done it?" (Amos 3:6)

So again, everything comes from God. It's all God's will, the good things and the bad. The place where free will enters the equation is when a person chooses their mission. It was God's will that the six million be killed, for reasons known to Him and not us. But nobody forced Hitler and the Nazis to be the ones to do it. No, they volunteered to do it. With joy. And for that they will receive the punishment they deserve.

As an aside, the Jewish internalization of this message is probably what enabled Judaism as a faith to survive the Babylonian exile. In the ancient world, when a nation was defeated, it was generally seen as a defeat of that nation's god or gods as well. Consequently those religions ceased to exist. Judaism was the only religion what saw the defeat of their nation as a victory for their God. Hence Judaism survived the exile, and Christianity exists today.

Ah, so in this understanding, God is responsible for His will and how that works out in the world, but those who act are blameworthy?