Iran, Then and Now

[Fenris]

At some point bombings will stop, Iran is crippled, but 5-10 years later Iran is back being its usual ugly self.

I'm also fond of a Camus quote.

'Perhaps we cannot prevent this world from being a world in which children are tortured. But we can reduce the number of tortured children.'

Perhaps we cannot prevent this world from being a world in which Islamic fundamentalists murder people. But we can reduce the number of people murdered by Islamic fundamentalists.

Destroy Iran's nuclear and ballistic missile program that they constantly threaten Israel and the US with? Hells yeah!

Kill their lunatic leaders who murder unarmed protesters in the street, execute gays and rape victims, and oppress religious minorities? Sure why not.

Weaken their military so that they're no longer a threat to their neighbors? Most definitely!

Weaken their economy so that they don't have extra $$$ to fund terrorism around the world? Absolutely!

I don't care if it only buys 5 or 10 years. That gives Israel and the west 5 or 10 more years to prepare. What happened over the last 5 or 10 years? Missile defense systems became available, both for short range and long range missiles; Israel has a system that can intercept ICBMs in outer space, and another, short range system, that fires laser beams at short range missiles. And in 5 or 10 years the Iranian government can collapse all on its own. 

Plus this war has an effect on other bad actors like China and Russia. China in particular gave tens of billions of military hardware to Iran, and it seems to be all junk. Do you think China is weighing an invasion of Taiwan with much more caution now? I do.

[Reddogs]

I don't care what happened in 1953. I care what's happening now.

Remember the old adage, 'those who fail to learn from history...😶

[Sojourner]

I don't care what happened in 1953. I care what's happening now.

The point of the post was to point out how different Iran was before the revolution--and could be today if the nation were governed by sane, responsible leadership instead of the religious fanaticism that so detrimentally altered its political and social landscape.

[Fenris]

Remember the old adage, 'those who fail to learn from history...😶

There's no connection between what happened in 1953 and what's happening now.

[Athanasius]

Remember the old adage, 'those who fail to learn from history...😶

There's no connection between what happened in 1953 and what's happening now.

[Fenris]

"Something happened in 1953, so we shouldn't work to disarm or overthrow an apocalyptic, religious fundamentalist, genocidal lunatic regime" is quite the take. 

[Athanasius]

"Something happened in 1953, so we shouldn't work to disarm or overthrow an apocalyptic, religious fundamentalist, genocidal lunatic regime" is quite the take.

That's not the take. The take is "we'd probably not be in this mess..." and if we're going to go to war with Iran, we ought to do so properly.

[Fenris]

That's not the take. The take is "we'd probably not be in this mess..."

There's nothing we can do about what happened in 1953.

and if we're going to go to war with Iran, we ought to do so properly.

I agree. Smash the Mullahs completely.

[Athanasius]

That's not the take. The take is "we'd probably not be in this mess..."

There's nothing we can do about what happened in 1953.

We can do something about it today, and the Americans and Israeli's are. But that's because those things did happen in 1953, so to say that 1953 has no connection with what's happening today is bizarre. Obviously it does.

[Fenris]

But that's because those things did happen in 1953, so to say that 1953 has no connection with what's happening today is bizarre. Obviously it does.

Every action has unknowable consequences. The allies aiding the Soviets during world war 2 led to the Russian invasion of the Ukraine. Does that mean we shouldn't have helped them?

You do the best with the information you have in front of you.

[Athanasius]

But that's because those things did happen in 1953, so to say that 1953 has no connection with what's happening today is bizarre. Obviously it does.

Every action has unknowable consequences. The allies aiding the Soviets during world war 2 led to the Russian invasion of the Ukraine. Does that mean we shouldn't have helped them?

You do the best with the information you have in front of you.

That means we can interrogate the past. No one here is talking about divining the future.

[Fenris]

That means we can interrogate the past.

I don't know what that means.

[IMINXTC]

and if we're going to go to war with Iran, we ⁸ought to do so properly.

The current state of the East Wing perfectly epitomizes the recent "haste makes waste" war stategy.


"For which of you, intending to build a tower, sitteth not down first, and counteth the cost, whether he have sufficient to finish it?" Luke 14:28

[Fenris]

At this point the goal should be regime change, not "a better deal". The current leadership has inflicted a tremendous amount of human suffering, both in their own country and in the region.

There's never going to be a better opportunity than there is right now.