Hebrews 4:15

[Athanasius]

Yes, you're describing moral imperfection.

I'm describing free will.

Free will in a morally imperfect individual, as clearly, though God also possesses free will (as you've said), God is incapable of sin (as you've said).

[Fenris]

Free will in a morally imperfect individual

Free will in human beings created according to God's will.

[Athanasius]

Free will in a morally imperfect individual

Free will in human beings created according to God's will.

As you said, imperfect.

[Fenris]

As you said, imperfect.

I'm fine with that term.

The bible never uses the term "morally imperfect" and so I will not either.

[Athanasius]

As you said, imperfect.

I'm fine with that term.

The bible never uses the term "morally imperfect" and so I will not either.

The concept is there, so I'm not too bothered by it. That is, the words we use describe the reality attested to, whether that's Hebrew, Aramaic, Greek, English...

[IMINXTC]

Christ is the only tested man to remain sinless and He lays down His righteous life for all sinful men.

[Fenris]

The concept is there

It's the concept I have problems with. Judaism values the struggle. It's the whole point of human existence.

[Fenris]

Christ is the only tested man to remain sinless

I thought he was God.

[IMINXTC]

Christ is fully God. Fully man.

[Athanasius]

The concept is there

It's the concept I have problems with. Judaism values the struggle. It's the whole point of human existence.

The struggle is there all the more. Moral imperfection doesn't mean impossible.

[Fenris]

The struggle is there all the more.

The struggle is the main point.

[Athanasius]

The struggle is there all the more.

The struggle is the main point.

Yes.

[ProDeo]

Gen 32:28 “Your name will no longer be Jacob,” He said. “It will be Israel because you have struggled with God and with men and have prevailed.” [HCSB]

[Fenris]

Gen 32:28 “Your name will no longer be Jacob,” He said. “It will be Israel because you have struggled with God and with men and have prevailed.” [HCSB]

Your point?

[Fenris]

OK, doing some mindreading here because you haven't explained why you're citing the verse.

I'm assuming that your point was that Jacob wrested with God, proving that God can "be a man".

My problems with this concept.

First of all, even if we cay that God can inhabit a human body, that doesn't mean that God is subject to temptation in the way that human beings are.

Secondly, the verse says "Elohim" not "YHVH". "Elohim" can mean "God", but it can also mean "the divine", or the "powerful", even pertaining to humans. In Exodus 7, God tells Moses "I have made you as an 'Elohim' to Pharaoh". Obviously Moses was not God to Pharaoh.

Thirdly, Jacob did not wrestle with God. He wrestled with an angel. Hosea 12:4 says this explicitly.