The end of NATO ?

[ProDeo]

https://www.euronews.com/2025/05/08/antisemitic-incidents-surge-across-europe-and-the-world-adl-report-shows

What are Europeans doing about this?

With US as most anti-Semitic incidents you better as first one explain what your country is doing.

[Fenris]

With US as most anti-Semitic incidents you better as first one explain what your country is doing.

The US has far more Jews than Europe. You know, because Europeans murdered millions of them.

Looking at the chart in the article you posted:

Germany had 2782 incidents in 2023. Germany has a Jewish population of 118,000.
The UK had 4103 incidents in 2023. They have a Jewish population of 292,000.

The US had 8873 incidents in 2023. They have a Jewish population of 5.7 million.

So the US had 2X the incidents of the UK, but has almost 20X the Jewish population.
And about 3X the incidents of Germany, but 48X the Jewish population.

The rate of antisemitic incidents in Europe is way, waaaay higher than the US.

This doesn't surprise me in the least. How about you?

[ProDeo]

You did not answer the question, what do you better than Europe ?

Refresh my mind about the name of the Israeli soccer club that played in Amsterdam and went totally out of control a couple of years ago and I will try to find what happened to the criminals. The event got world wide attention because of the violence, I just need that name of that Israeli soccer club.

[Fenris]

You did not answer the question, what do you better than Europe ?

Well, we are not importing antisemitic Muslims by the millions, for one thing.

Refresh my mind about the name of the Israeli soccer club that played in Amsterdam and went totally out of control a couple of years ago and I will try to find what happened to the criminals. The event got world wide attention because of the violence, I just need that name of that Israeli soccer club.

The soccer club was a pretext. The Muslim community planned to attack any Jews they could find, and they did. I'd love to know that justice was done, but I really doubt it.

[ProDeo]

You did not answer the question, what do you better than Europe ?

Well, we are not importing antisemitic Muslims by the millions, for one thing.

Refresh my mind about the name of the Israeli soccer club that played in Amsterdam and went totally out of control a couple of years ago and I will try to find what happened to the criminals. The event got world wide attention because of the violence, I just need that name of that Israeli soccer club.

The soccer club was a pretext. The Muslim community planned to attack any Jews they could find, and they did. I'd love to know that justice was done, but I really doubt it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/November_2024_Amsterdam_riots

Several local individuals who attacked Maccabi fans were given jail terms by Amsterdam district court.

The evening before the match, Maccabi Tel Aviv fans were filmed pulling Palestinian flags from houses, making racist anti-Arab chants such as "death to Arabs", assaulting people, and vandalising local property.

Plans to attack Israeli fans were subsequently shared through messaging apps.[4][13] After the match, Maccabi fans were ambushed and assaulted across the city centre, while a group of Maccabi fans around Damrak was recorded assaulting people and vandalising local property.[14]

The attacks on Israeli fans were condemned as antisemitic by Amsterdam mayor Femke Halsema,[15] Dutch prime minister Dick Schoof,[16] King Willem-Alexander,[17] and several international leaders.[18][19] The failure to condemn the Israeli fans' attacks, and their characterisation of the events as "antisemitic", was also described as being one-sided.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

As you can see many Maccabi fans were racists themselves and committed crimes on our soil.

[Fenris]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/November_2024_Amsterdam_riots

Several local individuals who attacked Maccabi fans were given jail terms by Amsterdam district court.

Oh. "Several". That's great.

As you can see many Maccabi fans were racists themselves and committed crimes on our soil.

None of this was reported at the time, and the only website with the article is behind a paywall. So, I'm calling "doubt".

[ProDeo]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/November_2024_Amsterdam_riots

Several local individuals who attacked Maccabi fans were given jail terms by Amsterdam district court.

Oh. "Several". That's great.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cwy81qvn7gjo

More details about the court ruling.

As you can see many Maccabi fans were racists themselves and committed crimes on our soil.

None of this was reported at the time, and the only website with the article is behind a paywall. So, I'm calling "doubt".

Here is a story, we had a hotheaded neighbor, not a bad guy, but he had mood swings and could burst out in anger out of the blue, as you can imagine he was not very popular in the neighborhood. About 15 years ago apparently it was my turn, I was driving my car from the parking place when he came out of his house and started to yell at me. No idea why. I did not say a word, just kept looking at him till he had finished his rant, he went home, I continued my way, shrug.

Then 5-6 years ago another incident with his direct neighbor, at about 23:30 he was yelling to his  neighbor woman and the woman just stood there, said nothing and let him rant till they both went inside.

The next day the neighbor woman came to our house and asked me what I had seen and heard. I told her. And she said we are going to sue him for antisemitism. I said, how so? And she explained her husband is half Jewish and in his rant he made antisemitic remarks about her husband according to her. And it was true, in his rant he named Israel but I did not hear antisemitism, he would say the same political statements about Erdogan or our own politics system for that matter.

Months passed, I got an invitation to come to the police station because I was a witness, I told them what I had seen and heard, no antisemitism IMO and it was noted and I had to put my signature under the document.

More months passed and the judge decided in favor of the plaintiff -> antisemitism. No jail but he had to pay a considerable penalty to the plaintiff.

I found the verdict unfair, these 2 couples were pestering each other for years with silly little things such as complaining about deliberate slamming doors and more childish things, both guilty, but then the neighbor woman found a stick to beat.

Anyway, the judge ruled different, for certain he had more information than me, so I have to accept his ruling.

I really wonder what your media is telling you, especially the last year, the Trump administration leaves no opportunity to put down Europe.

We recently heard the Rubio speech in Munich, the message: become like us (the US of Trump) and we will be fine again. And that is never going to happen.

The US wants a stronger Europe because of the new challenges, China & Russia wanting to overthrow the West. And US will get a stronger Europe, out of self-preservation. But we will not become American in Trump style.

[Fenris]

As you can see many Maccabi fans were racists themselves and committed crimes on our soil.

I want to go back to this for a minute.

"Maccabi fans were racists themselves and committed crimes on our soil."

Why the assumption that the Maccabi fans are outsiders? Maybe they're Dutch citizens who follow the team. Maybe they're not even Jews.

This is such a classic antisemitic trope. "They're outsiders". The German Jewish community was 1,000 years old when Hitler came to power. And he still called them "outsiders". And the Germans followed his lead.

[ProDeo]

As you can see many Maccabi fans were racists themselves and committed crimes on our soil.

I want to go back to this for a minute.

"Maccabi fans were racists themselves and committed crimes on our soil."

Why the assumption that the Maccabi fans are outsiders? Maybe they're Dutch citizens who follow the team. Maybe they're not even Jews.

This is such a classic antisemitic trope. "They're outsiders". The German Jewish community was 1,000 years old when Hitler came to power. And he still called them "outsiders". And the Germans followed his lead.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/_HRUV86bVa0

Really ?

[Fenris]

Really ?

No sound. I have no idea what they're saying, or who they are. Did anyone ask them for their passports, to verify what country they're from? I don't see any assaults, either. But sure, let's "something something both sides" after Jews get assaulted.

[ProDeo]

Really ?

No sound. I have no idea what they're saying, or who they are. Did anyone ask them for their passports, to verify what country they're from? I don't see any assaults, either. But sure, let's "something something both sides" after Jews get assaulted.

On top of the video is the sound button.

I did not hear Dutch, not English, perhaps it's Hebrew and you can understand what they are chanting?

It's hard to find English websites of a Dutch event, but here is particular one from Netanyahu :

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/netanyahu-86th-anniversary-of-kristallnacht-was-marked-on-streets-of-amsterdam-last-night/

Netanyahu: 86th anniversary of Kristallnacht was ‘marked’ on streets of Amsterdam last night

Not nice to hear, the Kristallnacht was state supported, the Netherlands locked up the guilty ones.

I did some further research on the Maccabi soccer club and they seem to have their own small section of what we call in Europe soccer hooligans whose only purpose is to create trouble, we have hundreds of soccer teams in Europe with these relative small number of hooligans that cause trouble, provoking and fighting with the police and/or the supporters of the other team is what they do.

So the Maccabi hooligans before the game were provoking insulting Arabs, Palestinians, Gaza, meanwhile during the game on social media tensions were building up and some Muslims took the path of extreme violence after the game.

Is it antisemitism? Absolutely, 100%.

From the Wikipedia - The attacks on Israeli fans were condemned as antisemitic by Amsterdam mayor Femke Halsema,[15] Dutch prime minister Dick Schoof,[16] King Willem-Alexander,[17] and several international leaders.[18][19] The failure to condemn the Israeli fans' attacks, and their characterisation of the events as "antisemitic", was also described as being one-sided.[20][21][22]

[Fenris]

On top of the video is the sound button.

I did not hear Dutch, not English, perhaps it's Hebrew and you can understand what they are chanting?

I can't understand it either. Why assume what they're saying if you can't understand it?

Netanyahu: 86th anniversary of Kristallnacht was ‘marked’ on streets of Amsterdam last night

Not nice to hear, the Kristallnacht was state supported, the Netherlands locked up the guilty ones.

No, the Dutch police locked up a few people for what was a widespread and pre planned event.

Yes, Jews are sensitive about violence. We've been exposed to far too much of it, and nobody seems to care. Again, in the wake of a massive invasion of Israel that killed more Jews than at any time since the Holocaust, European countries were lining up to recognize a Palestinian state.

I did some further research on the Maccabi soccer club and they seem to have their own small section of what we call in Europe soccer hooligans whose only purpose is to create trouble, we have hundreds of soccer teams in Europe with these relative small number of hooligans that cause trouble, provoking and fighting with the police and/or the supporters of the other team is what they do.

OK.

So the Maccabi hooligans before the game were provoking insulting Arabs, Palestinians, Gaza, meanwhile during the game on social media tensions were building up and some Muslims took the path of extreme violence after the game.

Is it antisemitism? Absolutely, 100%.

OK. Because we have a problem here. Admitting the problem exists is the first step, at least.

[ProDeo]

OK. Because we have a problem here. Admitting the problem exists is the first step, at least.

My dear Jewish friend, I am tired, how so first step? It has always been this way in my country, fighting antisemitism. You can make racist remarks here about the Turks who live here and get away with it, you better NOT do that with Jews, you will be prosecuted, I notable gave you an example from my own experience.

Mind you, you must know the story of Anne Frank, or the story of Corrie ten Boom (the hiding place movie or her books). These are the 2 main stories of Dutch people who were hiding Jews and paid the highest price.

According to the Anne Frank foundation Dutch people were hiding 28.000 Jews, many many were caught either by betrayal or by the notorious razzia's by the Nazi's, going from house to house looking for Jews. And when you were caught hiding Jews you were treated as a Jew and ended up in a concentration camp and later in the gas chamber.

Please, educate yourself first before you accuse.

https://nos.nl/artikel/2560268-ruim-120-verdachten-van-maccabi-rellen-naam-vaak-nog-onbekend

Dutch link, official report Dutch police, you need Google to translate.

You may have the last word.

[Fenris]

My dear Jewish friend, I am tired, how so first step? It has always been this way in my country, fighting antisemitism.

snip

Please, educate yourself first before you accuse.

It hasn't "always been this way" in your country. Around 75% of the Dutch Jews were murdered in the Holocaust, a much higher number than the surrounding countries like France (25%) or Belgium (25%).

I'm not blaming modern citizens and I respect that the present government is attempting to take the situation seriously. Be that as it may, there is a rot in Europe right now.

[ProDeo]

My dear Jewish friend, I am tired, how so first step? It has always been this way in my country, fighting antisemitism.

snip

Please, educate yourself first before you accuse.

It hasn't "always been this way" in your country. Around 75% of the Dutch Jews were murdered in the Holocaust, a much higher number than the surrounding countries like France (25%) or Belgium (25%).

That awful fact has nothing to do with our initial discussion.

Dutch were not killing Jews, the Nazis did.