The end of NATO ?

[ProDeo]

https://edition.cnn.com/2026/01/19/politics/nato-division-trump-greenland-threat-analysis

The end of 80 years friendship ?

[Fenris]

It won't happen, because the European countries need the US in NATO to hold back the Russians.

Having said that, Trump is a blowhard and a buffoon and shouldn't be acting out in this way.

This isn't even my biggest complaint against the man, either. His public declaration for the Iranian people to keep fighting for their freedom because "help is coming" and then not sending help while tens of thousands are murdered in the streets will certainly go down in history as one of the biggest betrayals. It's in line with what happened in Munich in 1938, in my opinion.

[Athanasius]

https://edition.cnn.com/2026/01/19/politics/nato-division-trump-greenland-threat-analysis

The end of 80 years friendship ?

Talking about it ending is just pretending the US itself isn't already finished.

[Fenris]

Talking about it ending is just pretending the US itself isn't already finished.

Well why are American soldiers in harm's way to protect a continent of Europeans that won't protect themselves? Not just from the Russians, but by taking in millions of immigrants who are opposed to their way of life, who hate Europe and America and Israel, and who are influencing European politics to reflect those viewpoints?

I have even more contempt for the EU and the European governments than I do for Trump. At least he's looking out for us. Sure, in a goofy and egomaniacal sort of way, but still way better than what's going on in Europe.

[Athanasius]

Talking about it ending is just pretending the US itself isn't already finished.

Well why are American soldiers in harm's way to protect a continent of Europeans that won't protect themselves? Not just from the Russians, but by taking in millions of immigrants who are opposed to their way of life, who hate Europe and America and Israel, and who are influencing European politics to reflect those viewpoints?

I have even more contempt for the EU and the European governments than I do for Trump. At least he's looking out for us. Sure, in a goofy and egomaniacal sort of way, but still way better than what's going on in Europe.

You surely don't seriously believe Trump is looking out for Americans. Honestly?

As for the EU -- whataboutism.

[IMINXTC]

"President Trump says his controversial push for U.S. control of Greenland comes after he failed to win the Nobel Peace Prize last year, adding he no longer feels obliged to think only of peace." NPR

We are way into Article 25 territory here. A health issue(?)


The reported letter stated, in part: “Considering your Country decided not to give me the Nobel Peace Prize for having stopped 8 Wars PLUS, I no longer feel an obligation to think purely of Peace, although it will always be predominant, but can now think about what is good and proper for the United States of America.”

[ProDeo]

It won't happen, because the European countries need the US in NATO to hold back the Russians.

I am not an anti-conspiracy guy, but I can't get the thought out of my mind, this whole Greenland drama maybe is a preconceived plan to get rid of NATO.

Having said that, Trump is a blowhard and a buffoon and shouldn't be acting out in this way.

This isn't even my biggest complaint against the man, either. His public declaration for the Iranian people to keep fighting for their freedom because "help is coming" and then not sending help while tens of thousands are murdered in the streets will certainly go down in history as one of the biggest betrayals. It's in line with what happened in Munich in 1938, in my opinion.

Indeed, a terrible betrayal and maybe a missed opportunity.

What about this invitation to the Kremlin to participate in the Board of Peace? How is your and Israel reaction to that?

[Fenris]

You surely don't seriously believe Trump is looking out for Americans. Honestly?

Compared to what the EU is doing to their citizens? 1000%

[Fenris]

We are way into Article 25 territory here.

Biden was drugged up and barely conscious, and nobody invoked it for him. Welcome to the new normal.

[Fenris]

I am not an anti-conspiracy guy, but I can't get the thought out of my mind, this whole Greenland drama maybe is a preconceived plan to get rid of NATO.

I don't think he thinks that far ahead. I think he just has monomania about Greenland.

What about this invitation to the Kremlin to participate in the Board of Peace? How is your and Israel reaction to that?

It's a joke. He's talking about peace between Israel and the Palestinians, yet he only invited Israel after he invited many, many other countries. And he hasn't invited the Palestinians at all. It's just another ego trip for him. His failure to act in the moment in Iran will have far more drastic consequences. His inner circle is full of opportunists who are on Qatar's payroll.

And yet he's still better than Kamala. What wretched choices we were given.

[IMINXTC]

We are way into Article 25 territory here.

Biden was drugged up and barely conscious, and nobody invoked it for him. Welcome to the new normal.

""We'll see what happens." Donald Trump

[Athanasius]

You surely don't seriously believe Trump is looking out for Americans. Honestly?

Compared to what the EU is doing to their citizens? 1000%

No, not compared to anyone. The current US admin, in and of itself.

[Fenris]

No, not compared to anyone. The current US admin, in and of itself.

Nothing takes place in a vacuum.

Is Trump ideal? Obviously not. He's capricious and temperamental and sometimes downright crazy.  He's shaking up traditional alliances in a way that I don't approve of, even if the countries in question are deserving of some of this treatment. He's expanding executive powers and potential future Democrat presidents are drooling at what they're going to do with this newly found authority.

Is he better for America than a president Kamala would have been? Absolutely.

Is he a better leader for his country than anyone else in the western world? Also yes. And it isn't even close.

[Athanasius]

No, not compared to anyone. The current US admin, in and of itself.

Nothing takes place in a vacuum.

Is Trump ideal? Obviously not. He's capricious and temperamental and sometimes downright crazy.  He's shaking up traditional alliances in a way that I don't approve of, even if the countries in question are deserving of some of this treatment. He's expanding executive powers and potential future Democrat presidents are drooling at what they're going to do with this newly found authority.

Is he better for America than a president Kamala would have been? Absolutely.

I'm not a congresswoman. A simple "no" is fine.

Is he a better leader for his country than anyone else in the western world? Also yes. And it isn't even close.

Who is on this list of "anyone else"? I doubt they're as good as Trump is at invading another country, abducting the leader of that country, stealing and then selling oil assets, and then sending the proceeds of those sales to an offshare bank account, but I could be surprised.

[Fenris]

I'm not a congresswoman. A simple "no" is fine.

Why the attitude? I'm explaining my thought process, just as you are.

Who is on this list of "anyone else"?

European governments encouraging the entry of millions of racist, anti semitic seventh century barbarians who are opposed to their way of life and want to implement sharia law is not in any way "good" for the people who live in those countries.

I doubt they're as good as Trump is at invading another country, abducting the leader of that country,

Maduro isn't worth defending. He ignored his electoral loss, emptied his prisons and insane asylums and sent those people to the US, and oppresses his own people. I work in immigration law and have heard the stories from people who escaped, and it isn't pretty.

stealing and then selling oil assets, and then sending the proceeds of those sales to an offshare bank account, but I could be surprised.

Venezuela is under sanctions from most of the world. The money from oil sales has been placed in a Qatari bank to keep it out of the hands of western creditors, so that it can be sent directly to the Venezuelan people. You may agree or disagree with this, but it has a perfectly reasonable explanation.