Can the law grant eternal life?

[RabbiKnife]

Jesus did not refer the rich young ruler to the rest of scripture.

He gave a fully understandable answer to a fully understandable question.

What the Christians are saying, with the exception of groups like the Franciscans, is that his answer was false.

No they aren’t

Jesus did t answer his question because Jesus knew the man was a slave to stuff and that his religious keeping of part of the law was his idol.

[Slug1]

And if he had said that to the rich young ruler, it would have been significant.

However, he didn't and he said something quite different.

The Gospels are not a bunch of isolated facts where one part is different from another part. The Gospel, which is detailed over four books, is a single whole teaching (full context). Meaning, instead of setting what is learned on one day of Jesus' ministry, apart from or against another day of teachings, one must study to find how they compliment each other and result in a contextual understanding of "The Gospel."

IOWs, what did Jesus teach about eternal life over 3.5 years of teaching? What He taught about the rich young ruler does not counter what He taught to Nic. Each teaching and the many more teachings found throughout four books (The Gospels) during 3.5 years of teaching, all come to a single understanding concerning eternal life.

[ProDeo]

Jesus did not refer the rich young ruler to the rest of scripture.

When a kid asks if it is allowed to squeeze the cat and you say no, should you also tell the kid it is not allowed to kick the dog?

[Fenris]

Can the law grant eternal life?

Kind of a strange question.

The bible's laws are terms of a covenant between God and the Jewish people. No place in the Pentateuch does God promise "eternal life" for following them, or indeed, discuss "eternal life" at all.

[DavidGYoung]

The fact that Jesus's instructions to the rich young ruler are not the same as the instructions Christians believe he gives to others is a problem for the Christians. It does not change the fact that Jesus clearly describes a set of instructions for obtaining eternal life to a person who has asked for one.

Those instructions were:
Keep the commandments.
Sell all your possessions.
Give the resultant proceeds to the poor.

Easy to understand? Yes.
Difficult to do? Yes.
Impossible to do? No.

[Betho]

The fact that Jesus's instructions to the rich young ruler are not the same as the instructions Christians believe he gives to others is a problem for the Christians. It does not change the fact that Jesus clearly describes a set of instructions for obtaining eternal life to a person who has asked for one.

Those instructions were:
Keep the commandments.
Sell all your possessions.
Give the resultant proceeds to the poor.

Easy to understand? Yes.
Difficult to do? Yes.
Impossible to do? No.

I emphasize that the "cherry on top" is the context of Jesus' encounter with the Rich Young Ruler described in the article. It is true that Jesus also discussed the topic of Eternal Life with another Jew, Nicodemus; however, this encounter was outside the context of the Law. In John 3, Jesus explained about being born again and entering the Kingdom of Heaven to attain Eternal Life. This is not the same path to attaining eternal life through the Law.

Furthermore, the article also mentions the bronze serpent, found in the Old Testament, specifically in the book of Numbers, chapter 21, verses 4-9. It represented a symbol of healing and liberation. The story describes how the Israelites, while in the wilderness, began to complain and murmur against God and Moses due to the hardships they were facing, including being bitten by venomous snakes.

According to the narrative, God instructed Moses to make a bronze serpent and place it on a pole. He told the people that if anyone was bitten by a venomous snake, they could look at the bronze serpent and be healed. Looking at the bronze serpent was an act of faith and obedience to God's instructions, and as a result, healing was granted.

The bronze serpent, therefore, was an object of veneration, a symbol of faith and trust in divine intervention for healing and liberation. In the context of John 3:14-15, Jesus was using this story as an analogy to illustrate that, in the same way, He would be "lifted up" (a reference to His crucifixion), and those who looked to Him in faith would be spiritually healed and receive full and eternal life, just as was done in the time of Moses. Therefore, the bronze serpent in Moses' story was a symbol of healing and salvation.

[Betho]

Can the law grant eternal life?

Kind of a strange question.

The bible's laws are terms of a covenant between God and the Jewish people. No place in the Pentateuch does God promise "eternal life" for following them, or indeed, discuss "eternal life" at all.

And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? [there is] none good but one, [that is], God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. Mattews 19:16-17  KJV

In this verse, Jesus is responding to someone who inquires about how to attain eternal life. Jesus indicates that the key to eternal life is the observance of God's commandments. Therefore, according to this verse, obedience to the commandments is seen as important in the pursuit of eternal life. However, Jesus offered the option of perfection and reward to the rich young man, while the path with Nicodemus is to "be born again" and enter the Kingdom of God to achieve eternal life, which is the main theme of the Gospels. One does not negate the other. While the first deals with eternal life for the circumcised descendants of Abraham, the other deals with making non-circumcised individuals also children of God.

[RabbiKnife]

How many of you are there that keep coming here and posting Johnny One-Note.

Or do you keep just making up new accounts like we are dense?

Have you sold everything you own?  Clearly not, unless you are using a public access computer to post this.

Bigger question.   Two in fact.

1.  Do you believe that Jesus Christ is God himself, deity, eternally existent and co-existent with God the Father and God the Holy Spirit for all eternity?

2.  Do you believe that the entirety of the New Testament and Old Testament writings are equally valid and powerful and truth of very truth, not just the words of Jesus recorded in the Gospels?

3.  Since you have violated at least one of the Ten Commandments (unless you claim that you haven't), on what are you relying for forgiveness for your sins?

[RabbiKnife]

The fact that Jesus's instructions to the rich young ruler are not the same as the instructions Christians believe he gives to others is a problem for the Christians. It does not change the fact that Jesus clearly describes a set of instructions for obtaining eternal life to a person who has asked for one.

Those instructions were:
Keep the commandments.
Sell all your possessions.
Give the resultant proceeds to the poor.

Easy to understand? Yes.
Difficult to do? Yes.
Impossible to do? No.

An extraordinarily simplistic view of Scripture.

[ProDeo]

The fact that Jesus's instructions to the rich young ruler are not the same as the instructions Christians believe he gives to others is a problem for the Christians. It does not change the fact that Jesus clearly describes a set of instructions for obtaining eternal life to a person who has asked for one.

Those instructions were:
Keep the commandments.
Sell all your possessions.
Give the resultant proceeds to the poor.

Easy to understand? Yes.
Difficult to do? Yes.
Impossible to do? No.

There is no problem.

Will the rich young ruler have eternal life when he squeezes cats, kick dogs, watching porno, etc?

Another example for Matt 25 -

The Final Judgment
31  “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 And he will place the sheep on his right, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, 36  I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’ 37 Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? 38 And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you? 39 And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ 40 And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers,6  you did it to me.’
 41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.’ 44 Then they also will answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?’ 45 Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’ 46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”


Looks different than the young rich ruler, but isn't. It's and/and not or/or.

[DavidGYoung]

What a number of the Christians here fail to notice is that, when Jesus of Nazareth was alive and doing what he believed was his public ministry, there was no such thing as the gospels or the rest of the New Testament. What would the rich young ruler have cross-referenced anything with, even if he had been instructed to?

Jesus could always have said something along the lines of 'There's no way you could possibly have kept all of the commandments', but he didn't.

Here is an example of a person being given, if this part of the gospel account is historically accurate (it is not necessarily so), a clear and unambiguous set of instructions. To call them anything else has serious ramifications when it comes to how much meaning there is in any other words Jesus is alleged to have said while he was alive, including the sayings that most agree are historically accurate.

[Fenris]

And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? [there is] none good but one, [that is], God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. Mattews 19:16-17  KJV

In this verse, Jesus is responding to someone who inquires about how to attain eternal life.

Again, the Pentateuch does not mention "eternal life" at all. The laws are kept as part of a covenant between Israel and God.

While the first deals with eternal life for the circumcised descendants of Abraham

Again, no place is "eternal life" promised. And it's not all of Abraham's descendants that are obligated to keep the law as part of a covenant with God. It's only his descendants via his grandson, Jacob.

[RabbiKnife]

What a number of the Christians here fail to notice is that, when Jesus of Nazareth was alive and doing what he believed was his public ministry, there was no such thing as the gospels or the rest of the New Testament. What would the rich young ruler have cross-referenced anything with, even if he had been instructed to?

Jesus could always have said something along the lines of 'There's no way you could possibly have kept all of the commandments', but he didn't.

Here is an example of a person being given, if this part of the gospel account is historically accurate (it is not necessarily so), a clear and unambiguous set of instructions. To call them anything else has serious ramifications when it comes to how much meaning there is in any other words Jesus is alleged to have said while he was alive, including the sayings that most agree are historically accurate.

You assume a lot from silence.  Jesus doesn’t say not to rape or behead people either

[Betho]

Again, the Pentateuch does not mention "eternal life" at all. The laws are kept as part of a covenant between Israel and God.

The concept of eternal life is found in Daniel 12:2, so it would be appropriate for a zealous follower of the Jewish commandments to inquire of Jesus about how to attain eternal life.

Again, no place is "eternal life" promised. And it's not all of Abraham's descendants that are obligated to keep the law as part of a covenant with God. It's only his descendants via his grandson, Jacob.

It is true that the concept of Eternal Life, initially associated with humanity in Genesis 3:22, appears to have been explicitly attributed to God alone, as seen in Deuteronomy 32:40. However, God's precepts remain an essential part of human life, as evidenced in Psalm 118:93.

In Genesis 3:22, the passage relates to the moment when humanity ate from the forbidden fruit, and God expressed concern about the possibility of humans also eating from the "tree of life" and living forever. This initial association with Eternal Life was linked to humans, but the continuation of the biblical narrative indicates that this condition was revoked for humanity.

Deuteronomy 32:40, on the other hand, reaffirms God's absolute control over life and death, emphasizing His sovereignty and authority over eternal destiny. This passage underscores the uniqueness of Eternal Life in relation to God.

However, God's precepts, as mentioned in Psalm 118:93, continue to serve as spiritual and ethical guidelines that steer people's lives. While the ability to live eternally may be exclusive to God, obedience to God's precepts is seen as a path to a life that reflects God's will and draws individuals spiritually closer to the idea of Eternal Life.

So, while Eternal Life may be exclusive to God, obedience to God's precepts remains a crucial aspect of people's lives, connecting them with divine will and guidance.

"Like the dew of Hermon that descends upon the mountains of Zion, for there the Lord has commanded the blessing, life forever." Psalm 132:3


*** The universal assembly (ἐκκλησία καθ᾽ ὅλης - Acts 9:31) throughout Judea was mostly made up of circumcised individuals.

[RabbiKnife]

What does circumcision have to do with anything?

What is your evidence for your statement about the makeup of the ekklesia?  At what point in history?

 Circumcised but I’m not Jewish…. Do I count?