coexistent modalism as the true Trinity

[Watchman of Naphtali]

The reality is that when Jesus rose again, He ascended to fill all things (Ephesians 4:10).

There are ten dimensions in reality according to the Bible codes in Genesis 1.

time is only the fourth of these.

Therefore, when Jesus ascended, He ascended into the tenth dimension; and therefore He exists as the risen Christ, outside of time (still in the flesh).

Since He exists outside of time, His existence goes into eternity past.

Therefore,

Jhn 1:3, All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

and,

Isa 44:24, Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;

I say again that God is one Spirit (John 4:24, Ephesians 4:4).

Therefore, if Jesus is not the same Spirit as the Father, He isn't God.

How have you managed to get this far, calling it "co-existent modalism" without realising that you're describing Binitarianism? Or I mean, if you want to be fancy, I suppose you could reach for Sabellianism, given your emphasis on essence.

It's just bad PR. I suggest you call it "Binitarian Sabellianism". It's a bit redundant, but people will remember it. Just remember I came up with it and any future uses will require license fees paid to myself.

So your whole thing here relies on Jesus going to the teeny-tiny 10th dimension outside of time, which results in him existing eternally, even though since he now exists eternally he would have always existed eternally, and then we'd have two Jesus'. Oh dear.

Yeah I'm gonna pass.

Also, the doctrine that I am preaching was labeled as coexistent modalism by someone else in an attempt to deny that it is in all reality the true Trinity.

But I accept the label; and will associate the label with the true Trinity.

The doctrine clearly does not deny Romans 1:3, Luke 1:35 as do the creeds.

But at every other level, the creeds are in agreement with the doctrine that I am preaching.

Oh well that person was a dummy clearly. I mean 'Co-existent modalism' is obviously a contradiction in terms and my idea is better.

It is no contradiction in terms if you understand how the paradox is reconciled.

[Fenris]

As in, you're suggesting Jesus visits the teeny-tiny 10th dimension in history and that places him outside of time, which if he's then outside of time he's always been outside of time, so when human Jesus goes to visit the teeny-tiny 10th dimension in history he'll be surprised to find himself already there.

Unless you mean, and we can accept this for the sake of argument, that Jesus really does visit the teeny tiny 10th dimension only once in history, and this places him outside of time for eternity, well, then you have this problem where creation doesn't happen at all because there was no teeny-tiny 10th dimension for Jesus to access or even a creation at all because he couldn't get to the teeny tiny 10th dimension at all.

You've constructed an elaborate temporal loop for human Jesus but have neglected the first loop which requires creation prior to Jesus accessing the teeny tiny 10th dimension.

Did I mention the 10th dimension is meant to be teeny tiny and really very _small? In any case, it's teeny tiny and really very small.

It's just one of those paradoxes and if we're ranking them I think it's a few steps below Loki and surely not anywhere close to the first Terminator film, maybe the first two. Their time travel gets wonky after that.

And no this isn't taught by John 1:1.

Why don't you just lose the Hollywood temporal paradox and the teeny tiny 10th dimension?

I am loving this conversation so much.

[Fenris]

Also, the tenth dimension is not teeny-tiny; as each new dimension as you go up in number is larger than the one that preceded it.

Nah dude, any dimensions above 4 (3 spatial, 1 temporal) are wrapped in teeny tiny loops. Much smaller than atoms, even. That's why we can't perceive them.

[Athanasius]

The reality is that when Jesus rose again, He ascended to fill all things (Ephesians 4:10).

There are ten dimensions in reality according to the Bible codes in Genesis 1.

time is only the fourth of these.

Therefore, when Jesus ascended, He ascended into the tenth dimension; and therefore He exists as the risen Christ, outside of time (still in the flesh).

Since He exists outside of time, His existence goes into eternity past.

Therefore,

Jhn 1:3, All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

and,

Isa 44:24, Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;

I say again that God is one Spirit (John 4:24, Ephesians 4:4).

Therefore, if Jesus is not the same Spirit as the Father, He isn't God.

How have you managed to get this far, calling it "co-existent modalism" without realising that you're describing Binitarianism? Or I mean, if you want to be fancy, I suppose you could reach for Sabellianism, given your emphasis on essence.

It's just bad PR. I suggest you call it "Binitarian Sabellianism". It's a bit redundant, but people will remember it. Just remember I came up with it and any future uses will require license fees paid to myself.

So your whole thing here relies on Jesus going to the teeny-tiny 10th dimension outside of time, which results in him existing eternally, even though since he now exists eternally he would have always existed eternally, and then we'd have two Jesus'. Oh dear.

Yeah I'm gonna pass.

Also, the doctrine that I am preaching was labeled as coexistent modalism by someone else in an attempt to deny that it is in all reality the true Trinity.

But I accept the label; and will associate the label with the true Trinity.

The doctrine clearly does not deny Romans 1:3, Luke 1:35 as do the creeds.

But at every other level, the creeds are in agreement with the doctrine that I am preaching.

Oh well that person was a dummy clearly. I mean 'Co-existent modalism' is obviously a contradiction in terms and my idea is better.

It is no contradiction in terms if you understand how the paradox is reconciled.

No, that's a contradiction, not a paradox. Otherwise, you start introducing an economy of the Godhead and then it's not really modalism anymore.

[Athanasius]

Also, the tenth dimension is not teeny-tiny; as each new dimension as you go up in number is larger than the one that preceded it.

Nah dude, any dimensions above 4 (3 spatial, 1 temporal) are wrapped in teeny tiny loops. Much smaller than atoms, even. That's why we can't perceive them.

Exactly this (I mean it's even the doctrine, and the "science". Missler told me so!).

I don't know how human Jesus is fitting into the 10th teeny tiny dimension without his guts spilling out (because human Jesus isn't a 10th-dimensional being and lacking the required dimensionality would just kinda not have a form) but ignoring that, does that mean that Jesus in eternity...

...is really very teeny tiny?

[Watchman of Naphtali]

The reality is that when Jesus rose again, He ascended to fill all things (Ephesians 4:10).

There are ten dimensions in reality according to the Bible codes in Genesis 1.

time is only the fourth of these.

Therefore, when Jesus ascended, He ascended into the tenth dimension; and therefore He exists as the risen Christ, outside of time (still in the flesh).

Since He exists outside of time, His existence goes into eternity past.

Therefore,

Jhn 1:3, All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

and,

Isa 44:24, Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;

I say again that God is one Spirit (John 4:24, Ephesians 4:4).

Therefore, if Jesus is not the same Spirit as the Father, He isn't God.

How have you managed to get this far, calling it "co-existent modalism" without realising that you're describing Binitarianism? Or I mean, if you want to be fancy, I suppose you could reach for Sabellianism, given your emphasis on essence.

It's just bad PR. I suggest you call it "Binitarian Sabellianism". It's a bit redundant, but people will remember it. Just remember I came up with it and any future uses will require license fees paid to myself.

So your whole thing here relies on Jesus going to the teeny-tiny 10th dimension outside of time, which results in him existing eternally, even though since he now exists eternally he would have always existed eternally, and then we'd have two Jesus'. Oh dear.

Yeah I'm gonna pass.

Also, the doctrine that I am preaching was labeled as coexistent modalism by someone else in an attempt to deny that it is in all reality the true Trinity.

But I accept the label; and will associate the label with the true Trinity.

The doctrine clearly does not deny Romans 1:3, Luke 1:35 as do the creeds.

But at every other level, the creeds are in agreement with the doctrine that I am preaching.

Oh well that person was a dummy clearly. I mean 'Co-existent modalism' is obviously a contradiction in terms and my idea is better.

It is no contradiction in terms if you understand how the paradox is reconciled.

No, that's a contradiction, not a paradox. Otherwise, you start introducing an economy of the Godhead and then it's not really modalism anymore.

That's right...because it is the true Trinity.

It does not deny the "three-ness" in the Godhead.

However, it does take into account verses that are often set forth by Oneness Pentecostals in order to proclaim their "Jesus-only" doctrine.

I do not hold to their view (as I understand it) because if there is not a distinction between Father and Son, it would be true that Jesus isn't come in the flesh.

Because Him being come in flesh is what makes Him distinct from the Father.

[Watchman of Naphtali]

Also, the tenth dimension is not teeny-tiny; as each new dimension as you go up in number is larger than the one that preceded it.

Nah dude, any dimensions above 4 (3 spatial, 1 temporal) are wrapped in teeny tiny loops. Much smaller than atoms, even. That's why we can't perceive them.

Exactly this (I mean it's even the doctrine, and the "science". Missler told me so!).

I don't know how human Jesus is fitting into the 10th teeny tiny dimension without his guts spilling out (because human Jesus isn't a 10th-dimensional being and lacking the required dimensionality would just kinda not have a form) but ignoring that, does that mean that Jesus in eternity...

...is really very teeny tiny?

Forget the tenth dimension; and suffice it to say that the Bible teaches (Ephesians 4:10) that He ascended to exist outside of time in the Person of the Son.

[Athanasius]

The reality is that when Jesus rose again, He ascended to fill all things (Ephesians 4:10).

There are ten dimensions in reality according to the Bible codes in Genesis 1.

time is only the fourth of these.

Therefore, when Jesus ascended, He ascended into the tenth dimension; and therefore He exists as the risen Christ, outside of time (still in the flesh).

Since He exists outside of time, His existence goes into eternity past.

Therefore,

Jhn 1:3, All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

and,

Isa 44:24, Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;

I say again that God is one Spirit (John 4:24, Ephesians 4:4).

Therefore, if Jesus is not the same Spirit as the Father, He isn't God.

How have you managed to get this far, calling it "co-existent modalism" without realising that you're describing Binitarianism? Or I mean, if you want to be fancy, I suppose you could reach for Sabellianism, given your emphasis on essence.

It's just bad PR. I suggest you call it "Binitarian Sabellianism". It's a bit redundant, but people will remember it. Just remember I came up with it and any future uses will require license fees paid to myself.

So your whole thing here relies on Jesus going to the teeny-tiny 10th dimension outside of time, which results in him existing eternally, even though since he now exists eternally he would have always existed eternally, and then we'd have two Jesus'. Oh dear.

Yeah I'm gonna pass.

Also, the doctrine that I am preaching was labeled as coexistent modalism by someone else in an attempt to deny that it is in all reality the true Trinity.

But I accept the label; and will associate the label with the true Trinity.

The doctrine clearly does not deny Romans 1:3, Luke 1:35 as do the creeds.

But at every other level, the creeds are in agreement with the doctrine that I am preaching.

Oh well that person was a dummy clearly. I mean 'Co-existent modalism' is obviously a contradiction in terms and my idea is better.

It is no contradiction in terms if you understand how the paradox is reconciled.

No, that's a contradiction, not a paradox. Otherwise, you start introducing an economy of the Godhead and then it's not really modalism anymore.

That's right...because it is the true Trinity.

It does not deny the "three-ness" in the Godhead.

However, it does take into account verses that are often set forth by Oneness Pentecostals in order to proclaim their "Jesus-only" doctrine.

I do not hold to their view (as I understand it) because if there is not a distinction between Father and Son, it would be true that Jesus isn't come in the flesh.

Because Him being come in flesh is what makes Him distinct from the Father.

So you're trying to offer a new doctrine of the Trinity, and not Binitarian, Sabellianism, or "coexistent Modalism" at all? Some just really, strange, doctrine of the Trinity where Jesus is teeny tiny?

[Fenris]

So you're trying to offer a new doctrine of the Trinity, and not Binitarian, Sabellianism, or "coexistent Modalism" at all? Some just really, strange, doctrine of the Trinity where Jesus is teeny tiny?

I think it's awesome that 2,000 years after Jesus lived, people are still inventing new theologies about him.

[Watchman of Naphtali]

The reality is that when Jesus rose again, He ascended to fill all things (Ephesians 4:10).

There are ten dimensions in reality according to the Bible codes in Genesis 1.

time is only the fourth of these.

Therefore, when Jesus ascended, He ascended into the tenth dimension; and therefore He exists as the risen Christ, outside of time (still in the flesh).

Since He exists outside of time, His existence goes into eternity past.

Therefore,

Jhn 1:3, All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

and,

Isa 44:24, Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;

I say again that God is one Spirit (John 4:24, Ephesians 4:4).

Therefore, if Jesus is not the same Spirit as the Father, He isn't God.

How have you managed to get this far, calling it "co-existent modalism" without realising that you're describing Binitarianism? Or I mean, if you want to be fancy, I suppose you could reach for Sabellianism, given your emphasis on essence.

It's just bad PR. I suggest you call it "Binitarian Sabellianism". It's a bit redundant, but people will remember it. Just remember I came up with it and any future uses will require license fees paid to myself.

So your whole thing here relies on Jesus going to the teeny-tiny 10th dimension outside of time, which results in him existing eternally, even though since he now exists eternally he would have always existed eternally, and then we'd have two Jesus'. Oh dear.

Yeah I'm gonna pass.

Also, the doctrine that I am preaching was labeled as coexistent modalism by someone else in an attempt to deny that it is in all reality the true Trinity.

But I accept the label; and will associate the label with the true Trinity.

The doctrine clearly does not deny Romans 1:3, Luke 1:35 as do the creeds.

But at every other level, the creeds are in agreement with the doctrine that I am preaching.

Oh well that person was a dummy clearly. I mean 'Co-existent modalism' is obviously a contradiction in terms and my idea is better.

It is no contradiction in terms if you understand how the paradox is reconciled.

No, that's a contradiction, not a paradox. Otherwise, you start introducing an economy of the Godhead and then it's not really modalism anymore.

That's right...because it is the true Trinity.

It does not deny the "three-ness" in the Godhead.

However, it does take into account verses that are often set forth by Oneness Pentecostals in order to proclaim their "Jesus-only" doctrine.

I do not hold to their view (as I understand it) because if there is not a distinction between Father and Son, it would be true that Jesus isn't come in the flesh.

Because Him being come in flesh is what makes Him distinct from the Father.

So you're trying to offer a new doctrine of the Trinity, and not Binitarian, Sabellianism, or "coexistent Modalism" at all? Some just really, strange, doctrine of the Trinity where Jesus is teeny tiny?

Like I said, forget about the tenth dimension and suffice it to say that the Bible teaches (Ephesians 4:10) that Jesus ascended to again exist outside of time.

[Athanasius]

Also, the tenth dimension is not teeny-tiny; as each new dimension as you go up in number is larger than the one that preceded it.

Nah dude, any dimensions above 4 (3 spatial, 1 temporal) are wrapped in teeny tiny loops. Much smaller than atoms, even. That's why we can't perceive them.

Exactly this (I mean it's even the doctrine, and the "science". Missler told me so!).

I don't know how human Jesus is fitting into the 10th teeny tiny dimension without his guts spilling out (because human Jesus isn't a 10th-dimensional being and lacking the required dimensionality would just kinda not have a form) but ignoring that, does that mean that Jesus in eternity...

...is really very teeny tiny?

Forget the tenth dimension; and suffice it to say that the Bible teaches that He ascended to exist outside of time in the Person of the Son.

Where's the fun in forgetting the 10th dimension?

So are you already in Heaven or God's presence or whatever it is? Because if you're going to be there in the future, and 'there' is outside of time, then is timeless you watching temporal you in some like, self-resolving loop thing?

[Athanasius]

So you're trying to offer a new doctrine of the Trinity, and not Binitarian, Sabellianism, or "coexistent Modalism" at all? Some just really, strange, doctrine of the Trinity where Jesus is teeny tiny?

I think it's awesome that 2,000 years after Jesus lived, people are still inventing new theologies about him.

I mean I have no problems with that in principle. Especially if they're novel and have notions like teeny tiny Jesus.

[Watchman of Naphtali]

So you're trying to offer a new doctrine of the Trinity, and not Binitarian, Sabellianism, or "coexistent Modalism" at all? Some just really, strange, doctrine of the Trinity where Jesus is teeny tiny?

I think it's awesome that 2,000 years after Jesus lived, people are still inventing new theologies about him.

The entire church gains added insight into the teaching of God's word as time continues to go forward.
 
Mat 13:52, Then said he unto them, Therefore every scribe which is instructed unto the kingdom of heaven is like unto a man that is an householder, which bringeth forth out of his treasure things new and old.

[Watchman of Naphtali]

So you're trying to offer a new doctrine of the Trinity, and not Binitarian, Sabellianism, or "coexistent Modalism" at all? Some just really, strange, doctrine of the Trinity where Jesus is teeny tiny?

I think it's awesome that 2,000 years after Jesus lived, people are still inventing new theologies about him.

I mean I have no problems with that in principle. Especially if they're novel and have notions like teeny tiny Jesus.

Now you appear to be mocking...

I assume that it is just for the fun of it?

Maybe you should seriously consider this doctrine.

[Athanasius]

So you're trying to offer a new doctrine of the Trinity, and not Binitarian, Sabellianism, or "coexistent Modalism" at all? Some just really, strange, doctrine of the Trinity where Jesus is teeny tiny?

I think it's awesome that 2,000 years after Jesus lived, people are still inventing new theologies about him.

I mean I have no problems with that in principle. Especially if they're novel and have notions like teeny tiny Jesus.

Now you appear to be mocking...

I assume that it is just for the fun of it?

Maybe you should seriously consider this doctrine.

No. You see, fun considerations are an interesting way to interrogate a doctrine. If our future selves also exist outside of time (do you think they do?), then we already exist outside of time, and that has certain implications when it comes to theory of time, and salvation, etc.

The teeny tiny Jesus stuff was in jest, but that's because the 10th dimension is teeny tiny and it's funny imagery. But like, I want to know exactly what you're saying. So, how far does this notion of atemporality extend?