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Messages - Fenris
1
« on: Yesterday at 11:12:46 AM »
Was listening to a call-in Bible answer program where the commentator inserted his own words into non-applicable NT passages making conclusions that the Bible does not offer and is silent on.
NOW YOU KNOW HOW I FEEL!
2
« on: March 29, 2025, 10:53:14 PM »
Ge 15:16 But in the fourth generation they shall come hither again: for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full.
One is not dependent on the other. It wouldn't make any sense. Again, the Israelites have to remain in slavery because the Amorites haven't sinned enough?
3
« on: March 29, 2025, 08:59:05 PM »
Absolutely, I sometimes think the intent of prophecy is not so much to predict the future as it is to built faith once it happens. Perhaps. Although since I think that all prophecy in the Jewish bible is to bring repentance, I think it's just telling us what the reward will be when we do repent. I can't argue with that. However, I believe there is coming a much greater persecution instigated by the rabid radical Islamic sects. Once they rise to political power, I see the beast kingdom arising from the ashes of the Ottoman empire and united for the single reason to destroy Israel(may God protect her)
It is possible.
4
« on: March 29, 2025, 08:56:43 PM »
This is pretty much how I see it: (no offense to Fenris)
None taken. All will be revealed in time.
5
« on: March 29, 2025, 08:55:17 PM »
The Israelites spent over 400 years in Egypt because the iniquity of the Amorites was not yet full. This seems like a strange way to look at it. The Israelites had to endure slavery and bondage because the Amorites hadn't sinned enough yet? What does one have to do with the other? Rather, the Israelites had to endure slavery and bondage to be prepared as a proper receptacle for the revelation at Sinai.
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« on: March 27, 2025, 12:28:54 PM »
Davy left because I told him he couldn't abuse Fenris.
Only the regulars are allowed to abuse me. Because I know you guys love me!
7
« on: March 25, 2025, 01:56:55 PM »
We often see prophecy through a west-centric paradigm. "Gog, the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal" Actually refers to the modern state of Turkey. This fact aligns closely with the idea that future beast kingdom will be an Islamic union rather than a European one.
I mean, maybe, but the biggest killers of Jews historically were Europeans. Rome, in 70 and again in 120, and then in modern times Nazi Germany.
8
« on: March 23, 2025, 11:06:23 AM »
That's a really nice post Fenris. For the Christian, the context of some of the situations you mentioned could be discussed, but I'd rather leave it as a contrasting viewpoint since you did such a good job.
Thank you! These are the discussions that I'm here for.
9
« on: March 21, 2025, 03:09:49 PM »
Why do you see it as a mischaracterization? So, a few thoughts. First of all, Jesus himself characterizes the Pharisees in a positive way. Matthew 23: Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to His disciples: “The scribes and Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. So practice and observe everything they tell you." Matthew 5: For I tell you that unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. Anecdotally, When Paul describes himself as a "Pharisee of the Pharisees", he isn't doing it to make himself look bad. He's saying it because the Pharisees are looked up to by the people. Most of Jesus's statements that are not found in the bible itself can be found in the Talmud, which was written by the Pharisees. For example, almost every verse from the Sermon at the Mount that isn't in the Jewish bible can be found in the Talmud. The Pharisee writings themselves emphasize kindness and humility and respect for one's fellow man. Jesus has almost nothing to say about the Sadducees, whose theology and practice and humility were much farther from what he preached than the Pharisees, which suggests that he felt they were so wrong as to not waste his time with them; while the Pharisees were so close to what he was saying that perhaps he felt they were "nearly there". And finally, we have to contrast Judaism with Christianity. Judaism is about upholding the Sinai covenant. This covenant consists of laws that God gave us to be followed. God loves us so that He gave us these perfect set of rules to live by; can we love Him any less by not trying to keep them as perfectly as is possible? I know the general accusations, etc. and don't want to take it there. But I guess Pharisees carried their religion on into the Synagogue era of the Jewish religion after the destruction of the Temple, and that seems to be what exists today. So at least from the perspective of contemporary Jews, I would guess Pharisees are seen as kind of founders of the current practice of the religion? Precisely so.
10
« on: March 20, 2025, 03:19:26 PM »
Pharisees for example were described in the New Testament as legalistic to a point of absurdity I feel that this is a mischaracterization. It sounds a little like you are saying it is a "work out your own salvation in fear and trembling" kind of thing within norms.
Judaism is not about salvation. It's about upholding a covenant with God. He gave us responsibilities and we try to do them to the best of our abilities.
11
« on: March 19, 2025, 09:26:34 PM »
Fenris is our dear friend,  I think that's the kiss emoji? and though he does not live in Berea I don't even know where it is!
12
« on: March 19, 2025, 09:24:38 PM »
You make a good point regarding the comparison between Jewish religion and Catholicism. Not a comparison so much as "if you need rules, why get rid of the old rules and introduce new rules?" And also "If faith alone saves, why does the church have laws for the adherents to follow?" I think it's a big weakness of Catholicism. I kind of made a soft point about this in our discussion above but didn't want to press the point. The Jews observe Yom Kippur annually and thus have to continually atone. Actually, we don't have to wait for Yom Kippur to atone. We ask God for forgiveness for our sins every time that we pray. Because we all fall short, so we try our best, and ask for forgiveness and mercy when we fail. Catholicism kind of fell (from a Protestant's view) into Paul's trap of tradition and a religion with rules (another Protestant objection) takes hold. This is another great point of Protestantism as they hold that the Bible (Scripture) is the sole and final authority for all matters of faith and conduct of the believer whereas tradition of the church is additive to the Scripture in Catholicism. Interestingly, Jewish religion probably holds close to Scripture as the final authority as well. Or does it?
Well, it's complicated. Because Judaism is a religion of rules (as mentioned) and so a religion of deeds. Faith, while important, is not central. Of course why would someone follow all the rules if they didn't believe? Nonetheless. Now, if you read the bible's rules, some are very clear ("don't steal" for example) and some less so. Even something as simple as keeping the Sabbath. It's the seventh day, but when does the Sabbath start? At midnight? In the morning? The bible says not to work, but what exactly defines "work"? And so the Talmud contained all these rules carried down orally from Sinai, so we believe. It's a compendium of information and logical tools to explain what the law is and how it is to be followed. The value is that Judaism is a very democratic religion in that this information is available to everyone and anyone can study the laws and learn for themselves. In fact, the Talmud states that in some ways, the sage is greater than the prophet, because the prophet can only tell you of communication from God, which a person can accept or reject; but a sage can teach you something and logically explain why it's true and then you can acquire that knowledge for yourself. I kind of rambled there a bit but I hope you caan get the gist of it.
13
« on: March 19, 2025, 02:08:44 PM »
Power. You can only have power if you write the rules. Since the Catholic group needed new power with a new group they made up new rules
The theological wrongness of this bothers me.
14
« on: March 19, 2025, 01:45:36 PM »
This all gets to the faith vs works "argument" between Protestantism and Catholicism. Works play an important role in maintaining one's good standing with the Catholic church wherein one is "saved". In Protestantism, one's salvation is through faith and managed primarily with God. This is just a sliver of the real issues at hand, but most are familiar with this.
And this seems to me to be the real weakness of Catholicism. We can all agree that Judaism is a "works based" (although I prefer the term "rules based" ) religion. If Christianity is a truly break from Judaism, why then did the Catholic church introduce new rules? Why not just leave the old rules in place then?
15
« on: March 18, 2025, 08:01:57 PM »
Air conditioning and indoor plumbing aren’t in the Bible either, but well, you know…
And hence, not real.
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