BibleForums Christian Message Board
Bible Talk => Theology => Topic started by: CadyandZoe on April 15, 2022, 02:45:46 PM
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Hi all,
I created a video to explain what day in the week Christ was crucified. Please watch and enjoy.
Jesus was crucified on Wednesday.
If you are wondering, the day of the week doesn't matter in the ultimate. But a study of this question helped me gain a bit more confidence in the veracity of the scriptures.
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Good job.
Personally I never trusted the chosen memorial chosen days by people in the past, Christmas being the best example, 25 December was a compromise between the new Roman state religion (Christianity) and the old one.
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I'm glad you liked the video.
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7 minute mark
The Passover sacrifice was brought on the day before the Holiday. It was consumed at the Seder that night, bringing in the first day of the holiday.
Removing leavening is not "work". It's not about "being busy, doing something". The Exodus took place on that day and so it is from that day forward celebrated as a holiday. But it wasn't a holiday on the year of the Exodus.
The animal is sacrificed on the 14th, not the 13th as you have it. The holiday begins on the eve of the 15th, not the 14th as you have it.
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It's not called good Friday for nothing. So yes, it was a Friday. If long standing historical church tradition were not enough, we also know that the day following crucifixion was a Sabbath day, hence, crucifixion was Friday. We also can date the Passion week from Palm Sunday, the day he departed Bethany and first arrived in Jerusalem, such that it is impossible for the crucifixion to be a Wednesday with daily travel to and from Bethany in between Palm Sunday and Last Supper.
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Historically it's Wednesday or Friday. Does it matter if we know exactly which day specifically? Probably not. We know it happened, we remember it as we should, and short of definitive knowledge that's about the best we can do.
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We tithe mint and cumin and forget the weightier matters of the law
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Historically it's Wednesday or Friday. Does it matter if we know exactly which day specifically? Probably not. We know it happened, we remember it as we should, and short of definitive knowledge that's about the best we can do.
I agree with your overall assessment in that the day isn't that important. At the same time, after I studied the issue I gained more confidence in the New Testament. I decided to make the video after "Jesus Interrupted" was published.
"Jesus, Interrupted: Revealing the Hidden Contradictions in the Bible (And Why We Don't Know About Them)"
by Bart D. Ehrman Feb 2, 2010
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7 minute mark
The Passover sacrifice was brought on the day before the Holiday. It was consumed at the Seder that night, bringing in the first day of the holiday.
Removing leavening is not "work". It's not about "being busy, doing something". The Exodus took place on that day and so it is from that day forward celebrated as a holiday. But it wasn't a holiday on the year of the Exodus.
The animal is sacrificed on the 14th, not the 13th as you have it. The holiday begins on the eve of the 15th, not the 14th as you have it.
Thanks for the correction, though I'm not sure where I went wrong. As I understand it, the twilight of the 13th is actually the beginning of the 14th, but I could be wrong. My brain is unaccustomed to starting the next day right after dinner. :)
I want to make a new video much shorter for next year. Your corrections will end up in the next one. Thanks for your help.
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It's not called good Friday for nothing. So yes, it was a Friday. If long standing historical church tradition were not enough, we also know that the day following crucifixion was a Sabbath day, hence, crucifixion was Friday. We also can date the Passion week from Palm Sunday, the day he departed Bethany and first arrived in Jerusalem, such that it is impossible for the crucifixion to be a Wednesday with daily travel to and from Bethany in between Palm Sunday and Last Supper.
Agreed, the day after the crucifixion was a Sabbath day. But was that particular Sabbath day on a Saturday?
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Historically it's Wednesday or Friday. Does it matter if we know exactly which day specifically? Probably not. We know it happened, we remember it as we should, and short of definitive knowledge that's about the best we can do.
I agree with your overall assessment in that the day isn't that important. At the same time, after I studied the issue I gained more confidence in the New Testament. I decided to make the video after "Jesus Interrupted" was published.
"Jesus, Interrupted: Revealing the Hidden Contradictions in the Bible (And Why We Don't Know About Them)"
by Bart D. Ehrman Feb 2, 2010
Ehrman, what a guy. I don't think I've ever seen someone argue so clearly in one direction, only to happen upon the opposite conclusion.
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Ehrmann
A solution in search of a problem
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It's not called good Friday for nothing. So yes, it was a Friday. If long standing historical church tradition were not enough, we also know that the day following crucifixion was a Sabbath day, hence, crucifixion was Friday. We also can date the Passion week from Palm Sunday, the day he departed Bethany and first arrived in Jerusalem, such that it is impossible for the crucifixion to be a Wednesday with daily travel to and from Bethany in between Palm Sunday and Last Supper.
Agreed, the day after the crucifixion was a Sabbath day. But was that particular Sabbath day on a Saturday?
Yes, the weekly sabaath, Saturday. I believe some have argued that special holidays were also called sabbaths, but I don't think that holds water. I believe that it makes the most sense that a "high sabbath" is a Sabbath that falls on a special day. Hence, the only work allowed to be done was the work required for that holiday. It would have been the second day of the feast of unleavened bread.
To me there are other indicators with the weekly cycle that point to a Friday crucifixion. Friday is day 6, mans number. The Son of Man was in the grave at "rest" from his labor on day 7. He rose again on day 1 of the week, the dawn of new creation. Palm Sunday through Resurrection Sunday would wrap up a 7 day cycle to complete the passion week. 4 days in Bethany (4 days with Pascal Lamb) 3 days / 3 nights in the heart of the earth (Jerusalem).
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Hi all,
I created a video to explain what day in the week Christ was crucified. Please watch and enjoy.
Jesus was crucified on Wednesday.
If you are wondering, the day of the week doesn't matter in the ultimate. But a study of this question helped me gain a bit more confidence in the veracity of the scriptures.
This is my first post, so hello to all. I want to reply to this because I am not new to forums, and have encountered a persistant argument by atheists that Scripture is unreliable due to Jesus not being in the tomb for three days and nights as Jesus proclaims He will be in (Matt. 12:40).
So, I do disagree that Jesus was crucified on Wednesday. And, I believe this does matter to show the reliability of Scripture.
Jesus was crucified the day before the Sabbath, Friday. (Mark 15:42)
Jesus was raised on the third day. (Matt. 16:21) (Mark 8:31) (Luke 9:22)
Jesus was raised on the first day of the week, Sunday. (Luke 24:1)
The argument comes for the atheist's side, in using (Matt. 12:40, that Jesus could not have been crucified on Friday because there are not 3 days and nights accounted for if He was resurrected on the first day of the week.
More to say, and I think this is important.
Quantrill
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Remember: Jews counted nights and days, with the calendar day starting at sundown. When Jesus described his burial, he talked about being in the heart of the earth 3 DAYS and 3 NIGHTS. So we went into the grave during daylight hours before the Passover started.
Jesus was crucified during the day on Thursday, the day of preparation for Passover. "Day 1" before 3 pm
He was in the tomb that night, the start of passover. What we would call "Thursday night" Night 1
The next day was Passover, a High Sabbath " (Day 2) Friday daylight hours, as we would call it.
That night until the next morning was Night 2 what we would call Friday night
The morning of the next day was Saturday daylight hours and the normal Sabbath (Day 3)
That night, Saturday night, was actually the start of what the Jews would call the first day of the week, prior to sunrise (Night 3)
Woman came to the tomb early before daylight on Sunday morning.
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Remember: Jews counted nights and days, with the calendar day starting at sundown. When Jesus described his burial, he talked about being in the heart of the earth 3 DAYS and 3 NIGHTS. So we went into the grave during daylight hours before the Passover started.
Jesus was crucified during the day on Thursday, the day of preparation for Passover. "Day 1" before 3 pm
He was in the tomb that night, the start of passover. What we would call "Thursday night" Night 1
The next day was Passover, a High Sabbath " (Day 2) Friday daylight hours, as we would call it.
That night until the next morning was Night 2 what we would call Friday night
The morning of the next day was Saturday daylight hours and the normal Sabbath (Day 3)
That night, Saturday night, was actually the start of what the Jews would call the first day of the week, prior to sunrise (Night 3)
Woman came to the tomb early before daylight on Sunday morning.
Again, (Mark 15:42), the preparation day was the day before the Sabbath. The day before the Sabbath was Friday. The Sabbath was Saturday. Jesus was crucified on Friday the day before the Sabbath. That is set.
Again, Jesus was raised the third day. (Matt. 16:21) (Mark 8:31) (Luke 9:22)
Again, the third day was the first day of the week, Sunday. (Luke 24:1)
You say, 'when Jesus described his burial', are you talking about (Matt. 12:40)? If so, how do you arrive at your conclusion that Jesus is talking just about His burial? After all, Jesus never was 'buried'. Never was 'in the earth'.
Quantrill
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It's interesting to me that the only reference to Jesus being in the 'heart of the earth' for three days and three nights is found in (Matt. 12:40). All other references just speak of Jesus rising the third day, or, on the first day of the week.
So, this single reference of the 'heart of the earth' must be defined by it's comparison to Jonah. "For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." (Matt. 12:40) (Jonah 1:17)
Note the similarity of Jonah and Christ's situation. Both were facing the judgement of God. Jonah for his own sin and Jesus for the sin of the world.
After the sailors knew that Jonah was the reason for the storm, Jonah told them to cast him into the sea. (Jonah 1:10-12) But the men refused. (Jonah 1:13) So, why didn't Jonah just jump overboard? Because their guilt must be associated with the cure. The judgement was from God, but it must be, in order to pre-figure the same with Christ, be carried out by the hands of man. And note the similarity of the men's refusal at first to do this with Jonah, and Pilate's desire to set Jesus free. (John 19:12)
The phrase 'heart of the earth' doesn't just speak to the time when Jesus was crucified and entombed. It speaks to the time when Jesus was given over to the governing authorities of the earth. This would begin the night before when Jesus was in the Garden of Gethsemane. (Matt. 26:31,34) "...All ye shall be offended because of me this night...." (Matt. 26:45) "...and the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners." And also, (1 Cor. 11:23) "...That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:"
Therefore, I believe the three days and nights in the 'heart of the earth', speak to the time when Jesus was arrested, crucified, buried, and ending when He rose on the third day.
Quantrill
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Remember: Jews counted nights and days, with the calendar day starting at sundown. When Jesus described his burial, he talked about being in the heart of the earth 3 DAYS and 3 NIGHTS. So we went into the grave during daylight hours before the Passover started.
Jesus was crucified during the day on Thursday, the day of preparation for Passover. "Day 1" before 3 pm
He was in the tomb that night, the start of passover. What we would call "Thursday night" Night 1
The next day was Passover, a High Sabbath " (Day 2) Friday daylight hours, as we would call it.
That night until the next morning was Night 2 what we would call Friday night
The morning of the next day was Saturday daylight hours and the normal Sabbath (Day 3)
That night, Saturday night, was actually the start of what the Jews would call the first day of the week, prior to sunrise (Night 3)
Woman came to the tomb early before daylight on Sunday morning.
Again, (Mark 15:42), the preparation day was the day before the Sabbath. The day before the Sabbath was Friday. The Sabbath was Saturday. Jesus was crucified on Friday the day before the Sabbath. That is set.
Again, Jesus was raised the third day. (Matt. 16:21) (Mark 8:31) (Luke 9:22)
Again, the third day was the first day of the week, Sunday. (Luke 24:1)
You say, 'when Jesus described his burial', are you talking about (Matt. 12:40)? If so, how do you arrive at your conclusion that Jesus is talking just about His burial? After all, Jesus never was 'buried'. Never was 'in the earth'.
Quantrill
There were two Sabbaths that week. 14 Nissan was not the regular sabbath, it was a high sabbath, and started what we would call Thursday night. Regular sabbath started at the close of Passover, starting on what we would call Friday night.
The Day of preparation started Wednesday night and ran until sundown on Thursday, when Passover started.
Jesus was certainly buried, and he called it "3 days and 3 nights", not 3 nights and 3 days.
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@RabbiKnife
Scripture indicates no such thing. Whose 'we'?
(Mark 15:42) is clear. Jesus was crucified the day before the Sabbath. The day before the Sabbath is Friday.
Jesus was not buried in the earth. He was entombed. And, 'burial' is not even indicated when associated with the three days and nights in the heart of the earth. (Matt. 12:40)
Quantrill
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Passover is 14 Nissan.
14 Nissan that year was a THURSDAY starting at sundown.
Maybe you should start there.
What do you call it when you put someone in a tomb and seal it? That's a burial, in the earth.
The 24 hour "day" before the regular weekly sabbath starts Thursday at sundown and concludes on Friday at sundown.
"Sabbath" is more than every Friday night. Every high holiday, including Passover, was a sabbath, and it didn't always fall on the same day of the week as the regular sabbath. So, the week Jesus died, there were two sabbaths.... 14 Nissan and 15 Nissan.
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@RabbiKnife
I don't need to start there. I start at (Mark 15:42). Jesus was crucified the day before the Sabbath. The Sabbath is Saturday. The day before is Friday. Scripture is clear.
You can call it a burial but Christ was entombed. He was not buried in the earth. But, again, the burial or entombment is not the focus of Jesus being three days and nights in the heart of the earth. Burial or entombment is not even mentioned. (Matt. 12:40)
Where is the Scripture that speaks of two Sabbaths the week Jesus died?
And again, as to my question you didn't answer, who is 'we'?
Quantrill
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Passover is 14 Nissan.
15. The sacrifice is brought on the 14th.
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Thanks, my friend.
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1. Scripture is true.
2. Jesus says "three days and three nights" in the earth.
3. If we aren't smart enough to figure it out, that's on us, not on Him.
4. Jesus was not crucified on Friday afternoon and raised Sunday before sunrise.
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Does whether or not Jesus was three days and three nights in the tomb, just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, matter? The question is, what is the penalty for being a prophet of God and getting a prophesy wrong? Well, it's stoning to death for your sins. Does it matter if Jesus was a prophet of God, or a sinner who should be stoned to death for His sins? Well, if Jesus is a sinner, He needed to die for His own sins.
The good news... everyone knew He was in the tomb for a full three days and a full three nights, in bible times or all His detractors would have stated, "He was a false prophet and a sinner deserving to die for His sins." And they'd have been right. But this never happened. So, the question becomes, how do you get three days AND three nights out of: Died on Friday afternoon, in the tomb at dusk, out of the tomb before dawn on the first day of the week (Sunday)? The woman showed up at the tomb before dawn and He was already gone. The answer: You can't. Sorry, that's one, and a portion "nights", and 1 "day". Jesus was a false prophet who should have been stoned to death for His sins, and since He had to die for His own sins, He can't pay the penalty for anyone else's.
So what's the solution? For that day was a "High Day". The "Sabbath" Jesus died on was a High Sabbath. Passover, to be specific. What day of the week is Passover? Since it's based on moons and not on days of the week, it can fall on any day of the week. Interestingly, those who have gone back and studied the moon phases in the years anyone believes Jesus was crucified, has found that none of those Passovers could have fallen on a Friday. The moon phases never line up with any Fridays. Wednesdays' yes. A Tuesday, But no Friday. So, since no one called foul and stated Jesus was a false prophet because He got the length of time in the tomb wrong, and since most scholars agree on the approximate year of His death, and since twice in those years Passover fell on a Wednesday, let's try that one out.
We have Wednesday night. 1 Night, Thursday day, 1 Night and 1 day. We have Thursday Night, 2 nights and 1 day, we have Friday day, 2 Nights and 2 Days. We have Friday night. # nights and 2 days. We have Saturday day, 3 nights and 3 days. And interestingly enough, it says Jesus rose "Early on the first day of the week". But, since the Jews calculate days from dusk till dusk, Jesus rose Saturday night at dusk after 3 days and 3 nights in the tomb.
Thus, if you want to be accurate, we have "Good Wednesday" and "Easter Saturday". Or, Jesus was a false prophet and should have been stoned to death not crucified. Pick one.