Distractions: Alcohol, Guns, Pornography, Video Games, Gambling...

[RabbiKnife]

Because we hates thems, we doess....we hatesss nasssty homosssexxxxxualsssssses... and anytime we can label something as being nasssssssstier than our stuff we do so.

Because we as Christians, especially in the North American evangelical culture, have largely lost the ability to grapple with difficult issues that affect actual human beings and more importantly, our actual brothers and sisters (not in the same person, mind you!) in Christ, without resorting to cliche, fear, or "there but the grace of God go I" type arguments.

Life in a fallen world is complicated.  As you certainly know, issues related to gender dysphoria are primarily non-corporeal in nature as opposed to physiologically/biologically based, although as with all thing occurring in the meat suit, there is a certain about of biochemistry that moves all the pieces around the board.

[ProDeo]

And on this topic, there's a lot of proof-texting. The best argument as far as I can tell is the appeal to God's created order and intention for the sexes. Fair enough. What complicates that is the reality of mental health and the accompanying bioethical questions. As I was saying earlier, I can affirm Genesis and Jesus until I'm blue in the face, but I must still contend with the psychological reality.

Then contend with the psychological reality, but don't ignore the biblical order. The psychological reality is that Christ rules over our will, and denial of that simply means we are retaining control over our lives, instead of yielding them up to the Spirit.

I'm not going to say I have a compulsion to murder, and simply must point a gun and shoot to get over the confusion of whether I'm a murderer or not. Getting rid of compulsions towards violence, theft, or addictions of many kinds is no different than dealing with "gender dysphoria," as I see it. And yes, I don't walk in your shoes.

I'm not judging you--you have to let the Bible judge you based on your own understanding of it. I'm just giving you my understanding.

And herein lies the problem, you don't.

Ever been suicidal?
 

[IMINXTC]

It will be edifying and encouraging (finally) to prayerfully watch the Lord deliver in this as in many difficult circumstances.

[RandyPNW]

And on this topic, there's a lot of proof-texting. The best argument as far as I can tell is the appeal to God's created order and intention for the sexes. Fair enough. What complicates that is the reality of mental health and the accompanying bioethical questions. As I was saying earlier, I can affirm Genesis and Jesus until I'm blue in the face, but I must still contend with the psychological reality.

Then contend with the psychological reality, but don't ignore the biblical order. The psychological reality is that Christ rules over our will, and denial of that simply means we are retaining control over our lives, instead of yielding them up to the Spirit.

I'm not going to say I have a compulsion to murder, and simply must point a gun and shoot to get over the confusion of whether I'm a murderer or not. Getting rid of compulsions towards violence, theft, or addictions of many kinds is no different than dealing with "gender dysphoria," as I see it. And yes, I don't walk in your shoes.

I'm not judging you--you have to let the Bible judge you based on your own understanding of it. I'm just giving you my understanding.

And herein lies the problem, you don't.

Ever been suicidal?

Yes. But in the words of Stevie Nicks: "You're saying I'm fragile
I try not to be
I search only
For something
I can't see

I have my own life
And I am stronger
Than you know"

[ProDeo]

And on this topic, there's a lot of proof-texting. The best argument as far as I can tell is the appeal to God's created order and intention for the sexes. Fair enough. What complicates that is the reality of mental health and the accompanying bioethical questions. As I was saying earlier, I can affirm Genesis and Jesus until I'm blue in the face, but I must still contend with the psychological reality.

Then contend with the psychological reality, but don't ignore the biblical order. The psychological reality is that Christ rules over our will, and denial of that simply means we are retaining control over our lives, instead of yielding them up to the Spirit.

I'm not going to say I have a compulsion to murder, and simply must point a gun and shoot to get over the confusion of whether I'm a murderer or not. Getting rid of compulsions towards violence, theft, or addictions of many kinds is no different than dealing with "gender dysphoria," as I see it. And yes, I don't walk in your shoes.

I'm not judging you--you have to let the Bible judge you based on your own understanding of it. I'm just giving you my understanding.

And herein lies the problem, you don't.

Ever been suicidal?

Yes. But in the words of Stevie Nicks: "You're saying I'm fragile
I try not to be
I search only
For something
I can't see

I have my own life
And I am stronger
Than you know"

NO [!]

A suicidal person has tried everything, can not do better, is unable, can not stand the immense inner pressure much longer and thoughts of suicide start to develop. Not that the person hates life, on the contrary, everyone wants to live but the ongoing and never ending inner pain, the impotence to change, the prospect there is no future, and for Christians perhaps also, the guilt, all of that toxic cocktail has exhausted a person up to a point there is no strength left any longer. It's not something of a couple of weeks but often a process of years of immense suffering. You have no idea.

And I can tell you from personal experience that the last thing a suicidal CHRISTIAN person needs is criticism, worse told that he is ungodly. He needs comfort, empathy, love, to be heard and understood. Tell you my story, try to understand.

Been there, the year is 1988. Severely depressed for years, taking ~10 pills a day, a walking zombie. At church we had rotating preachers and sometimes preachers spoke prophecies and on a given sunday I got such a personal prophecy which was negative. And for my vulnerable state of mind that was too much, the Lord condemning me was the last drop, I could not stand it and it was very very close if you know what I mean.

Bottom line, don't judge what you don't understand because you don't. Show compassion with those who suffer, they need it, heck, it's a commandment.
 

[Athanasius]

NO [!]

A suicidal person has tried everything, can not do better, is unable, can not stand the immense inner pressure much longer and thoughts of suicide start to develop. Not that the person hates life, on the contrary, everyone wants to live but the ongoing and never ending inner pain, the impotence to change, the prospect there is no future, and for Christians perhaps also, the guilt, all of that toxic cocktail has exhausted a person up to a point there is no strength left any longer. It's not something of a couple of weeks but often a process of years of immense suffering. You have no idea.

And I can tell you from personal experience that the last thing a suicidal CHRISTIAN person needs is criticism, worse told that he is ungodly. He needs comfort, empathy, love, to be heard and understood. Tell you my story, try to understand.

Been there, the year is 1988. Severely depressed for years, taking ~10 pills a day, a walking zombie. At church we had rotating preachers and sometimes preachers spoke prophecies and on a given sunday I got such a personal prophecy which was negative. And for my vulnerable state of mind that was too much, the Lord condemning me was the last drop, I could not stand it and it was very very close if you know what I mean.

Bottom line, don't judge what you don't understand because you don't. Show compassion with those who suffer, they need it, heck, it's a commandment.

/thread. For real, this is excellent.

[Athanasius]

Yes. But in the words of Stevie Nicks: "You're saying I'm fragile
I try not to be
I search only
For something
I can't see

I have my own life
And I am stronger
Than you know"

If you think suicide is about strength or a lack of it then I'm going to say no, as well. It's certainly tempting to think that way ("if only I was smarter, or stronger") but it's not about that.

[IMINXTC]

Yes. But in the words of Stevie Nicks: "You're saying I'm fragile
I try not to be
I search only
For something
I can't see

I have my own life
And I am stronger
Than you know"

If you think suicide is about strength or a lack of it then I'm going to say no, as well. It's certainly tempting to think that way ("if only I was smarter, or stronger") but it's not about that.

Indeed:
Surviving cancer.
Demonic attacks.

Not for the faint of heart.
You been through it.

[RandyPNW]

Yes. But in the words of Stevie Nicks: "You're saying I'm fragile
I try not to be
I search only
For something
I can't see

I have my own life
And I am stronger
Than you know"

If you think suicide is about strength or a lack of it then I'm going to say no, as well. It's certainly tempting to think that way ("if only I was smarter, or stronger") but it's not about that.

Despair, hopelessness, depression--these make for suicidal thoughts. When you wait it out, and ultimately things change, then yea--you can say, "I'm stronger than you know." If it doesn't make you feel good, it does me. But I know my strength comes from the Lord.

[ProDeo]

Yes. But in the words of Stevie Nicks: "You're saying I'm fragile
I try not to be
I search only
For something
I can't see

I have my own life
And I am stronger
Than you know"

If you think suicide is about strength or a lack of it then I'm going to say no, as well. It's certainly tempting to think that way ("if only I was smarter, or stronger") but it's not about that.

Despair, hopelessness, depression--these make for suicidal thoughts. When you wait it out, and ultimately things change, then yea--you can say, "I'm stronger than you know." If it doesn't make you feel good, it does me. But I know my strength comes from the Lord.

Typical.

As if sever depressed Christians don't fully have put their trust on the Lord for a way out. I know the examples and I am not speaking of myself only. And some of them did not made it.

[Athanasius]

Yes. But in the words of Stevie Nicks: "You're saying I'm fragile
I try not to be
I search only
For something
I can't see

I have my own life
And I am stronger
Than you know"

If you think suicide is about strength or a lack of it then I'm going to say no, as well. It's certainly tempting to think that way ("if only I was smarter, or stronger") but it's not about that.

Despair, hopelessness, depression--these make for suicidal thoughts. When you wait it out, and ultimately things change, then yea--you can say, "I'm stronger than you know." If it doesn't make you feel good, it does me. But I know my strength comes from the Lord.

And what, I don't know that? You've clearly never been suicidal. 'When you wait it out', as if. This is the old "trust Jesus" or "you don't trust Jesus enough" tripe that's brought out by Christians regarding any mental health issue. Telling me - or anyone with a mental health issue, for that matter - that they're not strong enough, or they don't trust Jesus enough, or in the right way, is to utterly fail to grasp the reality of what's happening.

[Athanasius]

Yes. But in the words of Stevie Nicks: "You're saying I'm fragile
I try not to be
I search only
For something
I can't see

I have my own life
And I am stronger
Than you know"

If you think suicide is about strength or a lack of it then I'm going to say no, as well. It's certainly tempting to think that way ("if only I was smarter, or stronger") but it's not about that.

Indeed:
Surviving cancer.
Demonic attacks.

Not for the faint of heart.
You been through it.

And that's not even everything. I haven't yet met a psychologist, counsellor or therapist who quite knew where to begin after I've explained all the 'major' events in my life. There's a lot, and I started young. I've lived a life, I like to say.

[IMINXTC]

As if sever depressed Christians don't fully have put their trust on the Lord for a way out. I know the examples and I am not speaking of myself only. And some of them did not made it.

I should not actually be here. More than once. Cannot take credit for my having survived.

[Fenris]

Yes, "cross dressing"  is homosexual conduct. The Bible says so.

Where?

It is said in the prohibition itself, forbidding cross-dressing as a homosexual act. Gender confusion, in other words, is a homosexual act by biblical definition.

The bible doesn't say it's a homosexual act. In fact, a woman cross dressing as a man can't be prohibited as a homosexual act, because female-female sex isn't prohibited in the bible.

[Fenris]

I would distinguish between Rabbinic Judaism and the Scriptures themselves.

The scriptures themselves don't say what you are saying.

Bible Commentary is not always accurate, and includes a lot of opinions based on certain preconceptions, such as, Jesus is *not* the Messiah.

Jesus being the messiah or lack thereof is not a Jewish legal matter, it's a theological one.

There may be more than one intent in cross-dressing. My concern is the Scriptures' explicit prohibition against cross-dressing in the mode of gender confusion.

According to who? You mock rabbinical interpretation yet include your own personal interpretation and present it as binding. Who gave you that authority?

I rest my case.